Ambie and Crystal discuss a couple games they played recently, including Yggdrasil and Dreadful Meadows. Then, since it's still almost Halloween, we talk about games that have magic in them, whether it's fantasy magic or real magicians!
This episode was sponsored by Grey Fox Games. Use the code "BLITZ10" to get 10% off your entire cart.
Board Game Blitz's theme song was composed by Andrew Morrow.
Transcript
[00:00:06:26 - 00:00:37:21]
Crystal: Hello and welcome to episode 247 of Board Game Blitz, a podcast about all things board games that you can listen to in less time than it takes an indecisive child to choose which piece of candy they want from your bucket. Board Game Blitz is sponsored by Grey Fox Games. This week, we're talking about magical games. First, we discuss a couple of games we've played recently, Yggdrasil and Dreadful Meadows. Then we talk about some of our favorite games that involve the use of magic or magical things. And now, here are your hosts...
Ambie: Ambie
Crystal: and Crystal.
[00:00:37:21 - 00:01:17:29]
Ambie: Before we get into the main episode, I have an announcement that this Sunday, November 2nd is Tabletop Live Network, TLN.
Crystal: Woohoo!
Ambie: Yeah, it's a marathon of Twitch streamers streaming tabletop games, and I will be participating. I will be the last slot, which is 8 to 10 PM Pacific time. This is daylight savings, like happens that Sunday, so clocks change. But I will be streaming Murder at the Atelier, which is a escape room card game. So I'll be doing that, but I'll be doing it on my personal channel, twitch.tv/ambierona. And throughout the day, a bunch of other people will be streaming board games. So check out tabletoplivenetwork.com for more information on that.
[00:01:22:06 - 00:01:28:08]
Ambie: Recently, I played Yggdrasil. I also played this not recently, because this is an old game...
[00:01:29:22 - 00:03:28:05]
Crystal: But you played it recently.
Ambie: Yes, I played it recently for the first time in like three years. Three years ago was the last time we played it. But Yggdrasil is designed by Cédric Lefebvre and Fabrice Rabellino, published by Ludonaute. This is published in 2011. Yggdrasil is a cooperative game for one to six players, 90 minutes. It's like an old style cooperative game in 2011, where you're playing different gods from Norse gods like Odin and Thor and Frey, and you're fighting against the monsters and the bad gods like Loki and Jormungand and Fenrir. I learned about most of these from playing this game, so if you don't recognize those things, that's fine too. But basically, I think you're trying to like prevent Ragnarok or something. But in the game, the reason we played this actually was because we had six players. It plays one to six players. So we're like, "Oh, we have like one and a half hours and six players." We played it. But it's actually hardest at six players.
It scales more difficult as six players because when you're playing, there's this board, and on your turn, you get like three actions basic. Each player is a different god and they have special powers that change. But basically, you get three actions and there's different places on the board in quotes because you don't actually have to move to the places. You're like theoretically moving to the places to do the actions, but it's just representing different actions. You don't actually go on the board. You can do actions to like fight back the bad gods, which is the main thing because there's this place where the bad gods are. And at the end of each turn or at the beginning of each of your turns, you're going to draw a card from a deck. This deck has all the bad gods in it. And so you're drawing these cards every turn. One bad god is going to move forward and do a power and those powers are bad. And so like they keep moving forward and you have to keep fighting to just push them back. You don't actually get to kill them, you just push them back. And if five of them get past like the third line and don't get pushed back by the end of your turn, you lose. If three of them get past another two lines, then you lose. And if one gets past like the seventh line or something, then you lose. So you're basically trying to push them back so you don't lose until the deck runs out.
[00:03:29:12 - 00:04:20:29]
Ambie: Similar to Ghost Stories, which I've talked about before, it's another game that has that feeling of like pushing back and just trying to survive until you get to the end. But the way you fight is the gods, they start with a base strength of five. And as they get further along on the track, like past those five, three, and one spots that I was talking about, they get stronger too. So like they do worse things when they come out. They have special powers like Loki is bad. He brings out giants, which are other bad things that do bad things and you have to fight them. Like at first he brings out one giant, but then when he's in the later part, he brings out two giants each time he comes out and then three giants if he's way up here. And they're also at first, you have to roll five weapon to defeat them. And then as they're further on, it's six and seven and eight. But in order to defeat them, you roll a die and the die has zero, one, two or three weapon on it. So you can't just defeat them by rolling a die. You have to get other things too.
[00:04:20:29 - 00:04:26:07]
Ambie: So you can go to places like-
Crystal: This does sound a lot like Ghost Stories - it's impossible to actually do anything in this game.
[00:04:26:07 - 00:05:48:06]
Ambie: Yeah. So like there's a place where you can get elves, which you can spend after your die roll to increase by one or Vikings, which you pull out of bags. So you like there's four different islands and you get these bags that have Vikings and these bad monsters on them. And so the first island has like mostly monsters and a couple of Vikings and then they get better and better as the islands go on. But like you keep getting pushed back to the first island by one of the gods and then you reach in and just blindly pull out five and whatever Vikings you get to keep and the bad ones you put back in the bag. There are also actions that let you pull in the bag and just remove bad ones or like put extra Vikings back into the bag. So as you play, you're like making those bags better so that you can draw more Vikings. And those Vikings you can spend before you roll the dice to like increase. So basically you're going to be spending Vikings and getting elves to defeat the gods. You also have weapon cards. Weapon cards are the reason that it's easier at fewer players because the weapons are good against a certain god. So you get like the Loki weapon and you can upgrade it up. It's level one, two or three. And when you get level three, like that does three damage against Loki. So you can be specialized against fighting Loki. But when it's six players, one person has a Loki weapon. There's five turns before it comes back around. And so if Loki gets drawn all those turns and he's like way up front and it's like, oh, we can't fight him because it costs seven to fight him back.
Crystal: Oh, yeah.
Ambie: So, um, yeah. But I like it.
[00:05:48:06 - 00:05:58:08]
Crystal: Well, yeah, it sounds it sounds interesting and difficult, which you do tend to kind of gravitate toward games that yeah, but like that punish you a little bit in the midst.
[00:05:58:08 - 00:06:55:02]
Ambie: Yeah. In our game, we tried not to have the hard cards mixed in because there's also hard cards you can add in, but they're supposed to replace some of the other cards. And we accidentally had some just added in the deck, which made the deck bigger. So you have to like survive longer, which isn't supposed to happen. But I think we lost with six cards left or something. And there were only four cards extra and the cards that we lost on were not the ones that were like extra. So I think we would have lost anyway, but it was super close. And there were some times where it was like, oh, we have to like, we have exactly this and I have to roll a two in order to beat back this God and not lose this turn. And we did it and we're like, yes. And there were a couple of turns like that. So that was like really exciting for a couple of turns. And then we lost. It's like, ah, but yeah, so I like those exciting moments when you're super close and you do manage to feed them back or you don't. Yeah. So that's Yggdrasil - old style cooperative game that has a similar feeling to Ghost Stories, but it plays one to six players. It's just hard at six players.
[00:06:57:00 - 00:07:35:09]
Crystal: Very cool. Well, the day that this episode comes out is October 30th, which is the day before Halloween. So I figured I would review a Halloween game and that is Dreadful Meadows, which released in 2023, published by Arkus Games out of New Zealand designed by Lukus Adam. This is one of those games that OK, here's what I don't understand about how my brain works, Ambie. We're going to go on a slight tangent here for a moment because in board games, I've talked at length in the past about how I make weird snap judgments about certain games for reasons that I really can't like I don't understand why based on their look.
[00:07:37:01 - 00:08:18:15]
Crystal: I'm judgmental and bright colors usually draw me in. I like bright, vibrant colors. But also, I think I have an aversion to games themed around holidays. We know that, for instance, the Holiday Hijinks escape room games, which are all holiday themed or awesome. But I would say if we set those to the side, if I tried to think of games that are themed around holidays that are well known and good, I can't really think of many, if any, like there's very few. I think the ones that I've seen over the years tend to look amateurish to my brain in a way that I don't understand.
[00:08:18:15 - 00:08:27:07]
Ambie: I think it's similar to like IP games because it's like because they're selling based on the IP or based on the holidays, you just assume it's going to be just a cash grab.
[00:08:27:07 - 00:11:46:02]
Crystal: It's not going to be as good as it could be, right. Yeah. Which I don't know why I think like that about holidays necessarily because holidays are a perfect like grounds for grabbing ideas for games. Right. So regardless, what I want to say about this is Dreadful Meadows is one of those games where when I looked at it, even though it had bright, vibrant colors and like artwork that I loved, I was like, a Halloween game, it's probably not that good in my head. Like, that's what I was thinking. And I want to be honest about that because A, I don't understand why I do that. And B, it's a lie because it's a really fun game. And I think that there might be other people like me who will see this on a game shelf like in a store and go, oh, a Halloween game and just walk away and shouldn't. And let me tell you why. That was a long tangent.
OK, so Dreadful Meadows is a relatively light game that combines a little bit of tile laying, worker placement and I would say order fulfillment to some degree, because what you are doing is each player is a different confectioner who has a field where they are growing candy. And yes, you heard me right. You're growing candy because in this world, I guess that's the way things work. And so you acquire tiles by purchasing them. Each time you take a turn, there's different actions that you can take. You can buy tiles to add to your field. You can place your workers, which are your little sugar sprites, onto tiles in your field or you can even pull your workers off and that will trigger things too. Or you can buy harvesters to put onto your tiles, which will help them make more candy later, because usually to make candy, you have to put your workers out there. But if you put a worker out and there's a harvester next to them, they'll do a chain reaction thing and all of the tiles around them will make candy. And candy is not only a resource for completing order cards, as I mentioned earlier. It's like ingredients that you have to fulfill on cards to get points, but they are also the currency in the game via which you buy new tiles. So you have to balance like, okay, I want to make these candies because they're more valuable, but do I spend those candies to get more tiles or do I fulfill these orders with them? There's a lot of interesting decision making around how you use your resources. But like, that's kind of it. I've described almost the entire game's mechanisms to you in some degree, it is really quick and easy to pick up. And the more like as we were playing it, I was just like, why is this so enjoyable? It's just, there's something about it that really scratched my brain in the right way. And I really liked it. I don't know a lot about Arkus Games out of New Zealand, but I want to look up what other games they've made because I liked this one quite a bit. Oh, Shelfie Stacker is theirs. I like Shelfie Stacker. Oh, okay. I'll have to see if there's any others. But those that was the quick one that I saw. Yeah, I like it. And I think that this is just me trying to overcome my prejudices against holiday themed board games, I guess. Thanks Dreadful Meadows, you're helping. You're great. And I want to play you more even not around Halloween time. So yeah, I loved it. It's Dreadful Meadows.
[00:11:46:02 - 00:11:52:03]
Ambie: That's cool. And yes, you can play Halloween games even when it's not Halloween. I give you permission.
[00:11:52:03 - 00:12:09:13]
Crystal: I actually really love breaking out Mariah Carey's All I Want for Christmas Is You during not Christmas time, especially in like karaoke. That one really throws people for a loop and it's so much fun. Everybody sings along. They may all groan when it first comes on, but then everybody gets into it. I promise.
[00:12:15:04 - 00:12:52:18]
Crystal: Since it is still spooky season with Halloween right around the corner, we are continuing our conversations about games that are at least adjacent to Halloween. And so today we're going to talk about games with magic in them, although it seems like pretty much every board game. Well, not every. A lot of board games have some element of magic or mysticism or fantasy in them. And that's we're not talking about like, oh, there's dragons in this game. Therefore we're putting it into our list of magic games. Like for me, I was thinking about games where magic is like a key thing in the game. Like it's the main thing kind of.
[00:12:52:18 - 00:12:55:17]
Ambie: Yeah, like you're doing the magic kind of, right?
[00:12:55:17 - 00:12:56:16]
Crystal: Yeah.
[00:12:57:16 - 00:13:12:17]
Ambie: Yeah, it was hard for me to think of games that I currently play that were you're doing magic because like I have- a lot of fan- I like fantasy, but I guess I don't play that many fantasy games or yeah, I'm not sure.
[00:13:12:17 - 00:13:17:21]
Crystal: I mean, you like Lord of the Rings games, which, there's definitely
Ambie: I do, but I don't-
Crystal: magical elements, but those don't feel like magic games, right?
[00:13:17:21 - 00:13:26:28]
Ambie Yeah, those are mostly like you're going on a journey. There's like journey games. One of the first games I actually got was Mage Knight and there you're like mages, mage knights.
[00:13:26:28 - 00:13:30:15]
Crystal: You literally have a spell book, right? Or something you have a book that
[00:13:30:15 - 00:13:53:15]
Ambie: I don't remember exactly, but you had cards that like have spells and stuff. But yeah, you're like wizard mage people, but yeah, I only played it a couple of times, but that's like a really well regarded solo game. I don't play many solo games, but yeah, like a lot of fantasy games, as you mentioned, they're not focused on the magic. They're just like, that's the world and you're exploring. They're more like explorish games.
[00:13:53:15 - 00:14:59:22]
Crystal: Magic exists, it's just not the sole focus. Whereas in a game like Quacks of Quedlinburg or Potion Explosion, you're making magic potions. Like that is the whole, but like to me, first off, I love both of those games, Quacks and Potion Explosion. I played the Potion Explosion app so much at one point that it is very, very difficult to beat me in a game of Potion Explosion. Like I feel like I should play on board game arena more because I feel like I could get you. I don't ever play in the like competitive leagues that are on BGA, but I feel like for Potion Explosion, I probably could. I'm very good at that game. Like I complete two potions every turn without fail almost every game I play. Like I have got it down to a science. And the key for those of you who are not aware is the take an ingredient thing that is like minus one or minus two points. You do that every turn at the beginning to make sure you're completing potions quickly. And then eventually you won't have to anymore. But that's one of the tricks. Yeah. Like to me, those games don't feel magical, even if the theme is.
[00:14:59:22 - 00:15:18:13]
Ambie: Because they feel kind of science-y theme. That also reminded me of like Alchemists and Little Alchemists because you're making potions and you're like, it's like a magician alchemist thing. But it also feels kind of like science-y because it's kind of science combined with magic. You're experimenting and making potions, which feels more like chemistry, I guess. Yeah.
[00:15:18:13 - 00:15:31:00]
Crystal: Because Alchemists has, there's an element of deduction to it, right? Or something?
Ambie: Yes, it's deduction.
Crystal: I've always been curious about that one, but I just, it just like, ugh, it sounded like it would be too annoying. I don't know. Maybe I would like it.
[00:15:31:00 - 00:15:56:02]
Ambie: I got Little Alchemists as a review copy a while ago and I played it with my kids and like Little Alchemists, I like better than Alchemists so far because Alchemists was like worker placement and then like a little bit, the deduction part. I felt like it wasn't enough of the deduction part for the game. Like it was mostly the worker placement part and you didn't have to really know the deduction. Whereas Little Alchemists is focusing more on the deduction and then it's introducing it slowly and in like a legacy form. So like, I'm enjoying that better.
Crystal: So I just need to play Little Alchemists.
Ambie: Yeah.
[00:15:57:09 - 00:16:30:04]
Crystal: Of course there's other games where a specific type of magical creatures are like what the players are, like Broom Service. All of the players are witches delivering potions. So you're not making the potions, you're delivering them, but you get to be either a brave witch or a, what's the other, I can't remember the other term.
Ambie: Cowardly, is it?
Crystal: Yeah, cowardly. Yeah, you're either brave or cowardly in that game. I love Broom Service so much. It was won the Kennerspiel in the year it came out, 2015, I want to say? Oh my gosh, is it 10 years old?
[00:16:31:06 - 00:16:33:20]
Crystal: I don't want to think about that, but it's still so good.
[00:16:33:20 - 00:16:37:13]
Ambie: I'm trying to think of other games where you play as a witch, but I can't think of anything.
[00:16:37:13 - 00:17:25:10]
Crystal: I know there's got to be some. Oh, there's actually a game that was on Kickstarter or might still be on Kickstarter that I actually got to play a preview of not too long ago. It has a witchy theme, although I did not like the game at all. So maybe I shouldn't mention it. You know what? Yeah, we'll just say that not all games with witch themes are for Crystal. Hey, but you know what? When it comes to magic, it's not all fantasy because there is what is magic in the real world as in magicians. There are not enough magician themed board games in this world. As I say that, I have not even played the, like I want to play Trickerion sometime, which is technically a Euro game. It's about dueling magicians, I think trying to compete.
[00:17:25:10 - 00:17:59:183]
Ambie: Yeah, I played it once when it came out and it's, yeah, you are a magician and then you're like gathering your, I was going to say spells, but no, you're a magician. You're gathering your tricks, your illusions and tricks and stuff and like performing shows and stuff. So you're like, it's a heavy, it's kind of similar to like people who like Lacerda type games, like a heavy Euro or with lots of theme. I remember when I played it, I have a friend who's a professional magician and so like my magician ended up being basically like him and I'd like card tricks like him and going to performances. I'm like, I am this person.
[00:18:01:08 - 00:18:13:17]
Crystal: I actually believe I know who you're talking about and that's pretty cool.
Ambie: Oh, probably.
Crystal: Yeah, I was going to say, I think I know. We could give him a shout out on the podcast. Like, yeah, it's not like we can't mention who you're friends with.
[00:18:13:17 - 00:18:23:01]
Ambie Okay, yes. So yes, my friend, magician friend is John George. And so I was like, I am John George.
Crystal: Yeah, if you haven't seen John George's work, like look it up because it's pretty awesome.
[00:18:24:09 - 00:18:39:03]
Ambie: But yeah, Trickerion is cool. But yeah, I can't really think of many or any other games that are like real world magic. Most of the games I know are like fantasy magic and stuff, which is opposite from the real world where most of the magicians I know are real life magicians and not made up.
[00:18:40:29 - 00:19:28:01]
Crystal: I have always been fascinated by magic. Like ever since I was a kid, like I remember growing up watching the David Copperfield specials on television where he would make the Statue of Liberty disappear or whatever else. And truthfully, at this point in my life, I think those types of tricks are actually kind of boring now because I think that if the trick obviously cannot have been done in the real world, then it's not as amusing, right? I would rather have that slight little bit of disbelief like, did it disappear? Because if it's the Statue of Liberty, you're like, no, it did not. I think we know it didn't. But that flower on the stage, where did it go? I don't know.
[00:19:28:01 - 00:19:46:26]
Ambie: I actually prefer the sleight of hand close up magic because I've done some card tricks and stuff, but not like anything fancy. So I know it's a lot of work and it's a lot of dexterity and stuff to do those sleight of hand things. So I'm just impressed by the abilities of that.
[00:19:46:26 - 00:20:12:28]
Crystal: Absolutely. And I think you and I, you know, we both are relatively intelligent people. And so I think it's at least for me, you can maybe I don't know if you feel this way, but it's fun to get fooled. Like I sometimes like that feeling of having no idea how a thing was done. I also like trying to figure those things out because that's also fun for me is like trying to figure out what the answer is. But occasionally just being completely stumped is a lovely feeling.
[00:20:15:04 - 00:20:20:15]
Crystal: Do you have a favorite magician? Is John George your favorite? I guess you're friends with him. So you can't really like-
[00:20:20:15 - 00:20:27:15]
Ambie: Yeah, I don't watch many other magicians, so I don't like know a lot of them. Yeah. So John George is my favorite.
[00:20:27:15 - 00:21:00:12]
Crystal: I live in Las Vegas, as many of our listeners are probably aware because I've mentioned it a lot over the years, but maybe not for people who are newer. So obviously there's a lot of magic acts here in Vegas, and I've seen Penn and Teller now at least three times at their show at the Rio here in Vegas. And every single time it's phenomenal. And I like it's been now a few years since the last time I went. And I'm desperately wanting to go again, because those dudes got to retire at some point, like they've been doing magic for a long time. But I've been to other shows in Vegas that were not not not as good.
[00:21:01:18 - 00:21:07:10]
Crystal: The magic definitely runs the gamut in both board games and the practice of magic in real life.
[00:21:07:10 - 00:21:21:19]
Ambie: I've been to Penn and Teller I think once. Yeah. And then I've been to also the Magic Castle in LA.
Crystal: Tell us about the Magic Castle.
Ambie: I've been there a few times because John George is a like, you have to know someone who's a member or something to get in. And so like John George got us in. Yeah, it's nice.
[00:21:22:22 - 00:21:43:21]
Ambie: It's like castle like magicians go there and they have little shows. And so there's like a close up room and then there's like a few different rooms. And so you have dinner there and then you go to like the different performances and see them. And once there was this kid, he was like 16 or something because sometimes they have like juvenile performances. And he was really I loved his show because he was just deadpan.
[00:21:44:27 - 00:21:59:00]
Ambie: And so like just his persona was just like deadpan. He's like, I'm doing this. And it was like really funny. So yeah, I liked the him. I don't remember his name though. Oh, that's cool. And he's probably an adult now considering that was a long time ago.
[00:22:00:08 - 00:22:06:16]
Crystal: Well, I would hope he's an adult now then because otherwise he's reverse aging like Benjamin Button. That's the kind of magic that we don't need.
[00:22:06:16 - 00:22:06:25]
Ambie: That's the real magic. Yes.
[00:22:06:25 - 00:22:10:01]
Crystal: Yeah, that's the real
Ambie: That's the fantasy magic type.
[00:22:10:01 - 00:22:13:05]
Crystal: The magic was the magicians we met along the way, Ambie.
[00:22:13:05 - 00:22:34:14]
Ambie: But back to board games, like when I think of real magic like that, I just think of playing cards because they have all those like themed playing cards that are magic playing cards and fancy playing cards. But not as many modern board games are around like magic themes, I think. We need to have like sleight of hand. I feel like there might be a sleight of hand board game or something. I don't know.
[00:22:34:14 - 00:22:42:27]
Crystal: I feel like I mean, sleight of hand is very easy for some people, but very difficult for others. So yeah, like how could you incorporate-
[00:22:42:27 - 00:22:47:13]
Ambie: I meant as like a theme like not actually a dexterity game, but like I see a theme that
[00:22:47:13 - 00:23:07:13]
Crystal: Oh, I see okay. It does seem like, okay, like if I'm really stretching things a little bit here, Sheriff of Nottingham, where you're trying to slip goods into your bag to get past the sheriff. I think that is kind of a sleight of hand game. Obviously, people are not supposed to be intently staring at you when you put your cards in your bag.
[00:23:07:13 - 00:23:13:21]
Ambie: That reminds me that The Mind is kind of like a magician theme type thing, like mind reading, right?
[00:23:13:21 - 00:23:15:28]
Crystal: And there's rabbits on the cards because of that, right?
[00:23:15:28 - 00:23:17:09]
Ambie: Yeah, I think.
Crystal: Like that's kind of the thing.
[00:23:17:09 - 00:23:38:02]
Ambie: I just connected that.
Crystal: Which is the theme that everyone's like, why are there rabbits here? We don't understand.
Ambie: Yeah, cause it's like magical something. Also I guess there's other party games that have like magical, like we've talked about Phantom Inc. a lot. That's like ghost magic. You're communicating with ghosts.
Crystal: Ghostwriting
Ambie: Yeah. And I feel like there's other games where you're like mind reading and it's probably slightly themed around magic.
[00:23:38:02 - 00:24:39:25]
Crystal: Yeah. And I do think to some degree that, you know, as with a lot of themes that can be either strong or weak in a game, the player's buy-in can really make a difference. Like for instance, the classic VHS horror game Atmosfear slash Nightmare in the VHS game, the crypt master or what is it? Crypt keeper? I can't remember his name. He's talking to you from a VHS tape that's just constantly running. But if you play with the right people, you believe he's talking to you right now and you better respond or he's going to be angry. And playing with the right people and getting the buy-in and the belief can make a game like that really come to life. And I tell you what, watching Dave Luza have a staring competition with the crypt keeper on the television for like two minutes straight, one of the greatest experiences of my board gaming life, just hands down, does not get much better than that. So shout out to Dave Luza. That is one of my core memories in board gaming for sure.
[00:24:39:25 - 00:24:43:22]
Ambie: I guess with the right group of people, any game can be a magic.
[00:24:43:22 - 00:25:07:16]
Crystal: You know what? Sure. Wrap it up on that. We would love to hear from you all what your favorite board games are that involve magic, magicians, witches, wizards or something of that nature. So hit us up on social media or over in the Blitz discord. Are you not in the Blitz discord yet? We play fun games and have game night together. Do lots of cool stuff over there. Join our discord. Come hang out. It's awesome.
[00:25:09:11 - 00:25:58:14]
Ambie: And that's it for this week's Board Bame Blitz. Visit our website boardgameblitz.com for more content and links.
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Pass your cards from the left to right
Bye everyone!
[00:25:58:14 - 00:25:59:12]
Crystal: Bye!
[00:26:03:09 - 00:26:05:16]
Ambie: This weekend, November 2nd, Saturday. Um, Sunday, I mean.